[Web4lib] blue sky thinking

Wed Jul 26 12:46:14 EDT 2006

Nina's reply reminded me how important communication is when dealing with an
IT department -- either within or without the library. I have often run into
the "No" answer when asking for various systems-related things, and I've
never let that answer stand unquestioned for anything important. If the
reply is that the answer is "No" for X reason, then look into it. You may be
able to turn the "No" to "Yes" with evidence, as I did when I presented
evidence that server-side includes would not bring their machine to its
knees. Bottom line: don't let "No" be the end of the conversation if it's
something worth fighting for. Communicate _why_ you need what you're asking
for, and what will happen or not happen if you don't get it. Make your case.
Don't just walk away, whining and complaining.
Roy

On 7/26/06 9:24 AM, "McHale, Nina" <nina.mchale at cudenver.edu> wrote:

> All,
> 
> Sometimes, even with decent IT support, there are misunderstandings that
> affect service to library staff simply because external IT folks don't know
> how libraries manage information differently than the rest of the institution.
> I've been at a new post for five months, and the most common complaint I've
> heard and decided to do something about was limited publishing access; there
> were only about 4 people who had publishing permissions, and upwards of 20
> library staff who contribute and WANT to publish their own stuff. Our web
> pages are on a campus-managed server (which actually provides numerous
> benefits in our situation) and IT was reluctant to allow for looser
> permissions (a 002 umask), and I didn't understand why. I finally got to the
> bottom of it; they were worried about leaking patron information. They didn't
> realize that patron info is stored in-house on our III server, not floating
> around with the subject guides and other web pages!
> 
> Just another reason for all of us to be advocates for our technology, as
> everyone else has noted!
> 
> Nina
> 
> Nina McHale
> Web Services Librarian
> Auraria Library
> Denver, Colorado
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org on behalf of Keith D. Engwall
> Sent: Tue 7/25/2006 8:03 PM
> To: web4lib
> Subject: RE:  [Web4lib] blue sky thinking
>  
> Granted, I wouldn't expect *all* libraries to be able to take this kind of
> thing on, but I certainly think *more* libraries could.
> 
> I guess my point was that we're coming to a point in time when the amount of
> free, stable, easy to use software available is making the investment of an
> in-house server much more manageable than some may realize.  The leap from
> desktop expertise to server expertise is not nearly as far today as it was
> five (or even two) years ago.  Obviously, it is still going to involve an
> investment in time, effort, and
> money.  I guess what I was trying to find out is whether libraries think the
> benefits might be worth it.
> 
> Perhaps *managing* a server is too big a step.  I'm very encouraged by Darci's
> post about the Oregon State Library's efforts to provide public libraries with
> the opportunity to get comfortable in a server envioronment as they create
> their web sites.  Perhaps that is what we need more of, so that more libraries
> develop enough expertise to at least be able to take on their own servers,
> should they desire it.
> 
> Keith
> 
> Keith Engwall
> Head of Library Systems and Technology
> Catawba College Library
> kengwall at catawba.edu
> http://www.lib.catawba.edu
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Houghton, Sarah"
> Sent: Tue, 7/25/2006 7:30pm
> To: Keith D. Engwall ; web4lib
> Subject: RE: [Web4lib] blue sky thinking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Aside from having a good
> firewall to sit behind, what is the biggest reason against doing this
> in-house?"
>  
> For many of us, the answer is a lack
> of in-house staff with the expertise or time required to create, run, and
> maintain a server.  Many libraries, particularly public and school, if
> they're lucky enough to have any IT staff at all, have one or maybe two staff
> people whose experience lies in desktop computer management, not
> servers.
>  
> That's why library servers are usually
> run by the city, county, university, or consortium's IT staff, who tend to be
> larger in number and sub-specialize in things like server management.  Not
> that they all necessarily do a good job of sub-specializing--which leads to
> this whole discussion of insane limitations and bad service.
>  
> Sarah Houghton
> 
> 
> 
> From: web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org on behalf
> of Keith D. Engwall
> Sent: Tue 7/25/2006 2:49 PM
> To: 
> web4lib
> Subject: RE: [Web4lib] blue sky thinking
> 
> 
> 
> Aside from having a good firewall to sit behind, what is the
> biggest reason against doing this in-house?
> 
> We just put together an
> Ubuntu linux server for about $600 with 1 GB of RAM and 400 GB of storage
> space. 
> 
> Ubuntu Dapper Drake Server with LAMP took an afternoon to
> install.  Not *quite* out of the box solution, but pretty darn close. 
> The configuration was pretty minimal, and I just copied the web site over and
> it 
> just worked.
> 
> We just had to get a DNS set up for that box (two actually,
> one for the public, and one for a development version of the web page), and
> holes poked in the firewall for HTTP and SSH, and we went live with it inside
> of 
> a week or two.
> 
> Now, we have our own environment in which to gradually
> expand our capabilities.  I don't know how to do all the things we want to
> do, but gradually, I find something that's interesting, ask questions, read
> about it, and then if it doesn't seem too hard to take on, I try it out. 
> We don't have to ask permission to try anything new; we just do all our
> playing 
> in our development virtual host, and then when it is ready to go live, we copy
> it over into production.
> 
> I wouldn't call this a turnkey solution, but the
> configuration was a lot less than what I was expecting, and the support out
> there (and in here) is abundant.
> 
> It just seems to me that we're finally
> at a point where this technology is affordable, the tools are (relatively)
> easy 
> to use, and the support is readily available.
> 
> Keith
> 
> Keith 
> Engwall
> Head of Library Systems and Technology
> Catawba College 
> Library
> kengwall at catawba.edu
> http://www.lib.catawba.edu
> 
> 
> -----Original 
> Message-----
> From: web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org [mailto:web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org]
> Sent: 
> Tuesday, July 25, 2006 12:08 PM
> To: 'Web4Lib 
> (web4lib at webjunction.org)'
> Subject: [Web4lib] blue sky
> thinking
> 
> Hi,
> 
> This is just blue sky thinking and not pertaining to
> any institution in particular.  What if an institution wanted to gain the
> benefits that accrue to libraries that have excellent server access and
> support 
> in, say, a LAMP (Linux / MySQL / Apache / Php & PERL) environment but had
> limited means and possibilities.  Is there any reason why something like
> this scenario wouldn't work?
> 
> 1)  buy cheap space on a Linux shared
> hosting server that provides root access such
> as
>       http://www.spry.com/plesk-vps/ <http://www.spry.com/plesk-vps/> 
> /
> http://support.jodohost.com/showthread.php?t=1726
> <http://support.jodohost.com/showthread.php?t=1726> 
> / http://www.linode.com/products/linodes.cfm
> <http://www.linode.com/products/linodes.cfm>
> 
> 2) 
> identify open source tools that significantly expand capabilities
> (i.e.
> Content Management Systems or other database server driven
> tools)
> 
> 3)  either install and configure these tools oneself or
> simply outsource it to someone via a site like http://www.elance.com/
> <http://www.elance.com/>
> 
> 4) point a 
> DNS at this server only for those pages that rely upon the LAMP environment,
> but 
> leave everything else "in situ".  What would be the best way to do that?
> Could www2.yoursite.com be made to point to a different server from
> www.yoursite.com <http://www.yoursite.com>  (the
> difference being the insertion of the Arabic numberal two just after the www,
> or 
> is that not workable?)
> 
> Apart from the obvious potential downwides (i.e.
> the guy who bids the job proves not be sufficiently capable) is there a fly in
> this ointment?  Seems like the upside would be to enable public libraries
> to participate in some of the innovation that academic libraries are able to
> access by virtue of being embedded in technically forward looking environments
> with lots of computer science folks running around pushing the envelope,
> etc.
> 
> Regards,
> Mark
> 
>      
> 
> 
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