[Web4lib] google & library catalogs

Tue Apr 11 16:33:10 EDT 2006

A note on practicality:

Whether intentional or not, having search engines crawl library catalogs
is technically problematic in most cases.  From experience, we've had the
big three crawl our catalog and to be quite honest, they get tied up in
Knots.  To be more specific, search engines (a) have a hard time crawling
catalogs because they're webs of highly interconnected pages [one might
argue even more maze like than other sites] and (b) most don't have that
many entry points in.  A search engine doesn't use a 'search box' on your
site, and must be led into the catalog via a set of links to a record, or
record set.

Peronally:
I really agree with Roy, about working through groups such as OCLC and the
OpenWorldCat implementation to get the library 'face time'.  In reality
the more catalogs that open to google, the harder it would be for our
catalog records to be found.  WorldCat has more cache in what casey calls
the google economy than any one of us could separately, and it's working
on our behalf.

- adam brin
-------------------------------------
Tri-Colleges Systems Coordinator
Bryn Mawr | Haverford | Swarthmore
http://tripod.brynmawr.edu

 On Tue, 11 Apr 2006, Casey Bisson wrote:

>
>
> David,
>
> your suggestion that we build library systems that can be easily
> integrated within other systems such as learning management systems
> is well put.
>
> The time has passed where library activities were restricted to those
> occurring within the library, and we now have to think about how our
> resources will be used in a variety of electronic environments. The
> cornerstones of the Google economy -- indexability and linkability --
> do well to serve our needs not only in LMSs and academic portals, but
> also in our email or IM communications and in environments even
> further afield, such as blogs or Facebook.
>
> Thank you,
>
> --Casey
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 11, 2006, at 3:33 PM, David Walker wrote:
>
> > Sara,
> >
> > Putting your digital collections aside for a second, you might want to
> > consider whether Google really is the best mechanism for exposing your
> > own users at the University of Oregon to your collections.
> >
> > Google is, of course, popular and sexy; and no doubt all of your users
> > start their research there or in another search engine.
> >
> > But throwing your catalog records into the Great Big Index Of Stuff is
> > kind of like your local mom-and-pop supermarket using national
> > television networks to advertise a sale on oranges.  You won't get as
> > big a reach advertising in the local newspaper, but focusing your
> > advertising on people who will actually find it useful and meaningful
> > can be far more effective.
> >
> > Given limited budgets and resources, I would personally opt to invest
> > resources into integrating your collections into whatever learning
> > management system(s) and/or portal you all have there at the
> > University
> > of Oregon.  Those systems are *heavily* used by your core audience,
> > and
> > the current level of integration between library systems and learning
> > management systems could be greatly improved.
> >
> > You may not get as many visits as from a high placement in a Google
> > result set (although most of your records probably won't appear high
> > enough to be effective anyway), but visits mean nothing unless they
> > actually result in check-outs.
> >
> > --Dave
> >
> > =========================
> > David Walker
> > Web Development Librarian
> > Library, Cal State San Marcos
> > 760-750-4379
> > http://public.csusm.edu/dwalker
> > =========================
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org
> > [mailto:web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org] On Behalf Of Casey Bisson
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 10:45 AM
> > To: web4lib at webjunction.org
> > Cc: Sara Brownmiller
> > Subject: Re: [Web4lib] google & library catalogs
> >
> > Sara,
> >
> > With more than 80 million Americans searching the web on any given
> > day, and major search engines handling five billion searches per
> > month, it's hard to imagine not wanting to make library resources
> > findable and available to those users.
> >
> > Google scares and confuses most of us, but I like to describe it as a
> > giant OPAC with cataloging rules much like those we're already
> > familiar with (even if those rules are different from what we're
> > familiar with). Unfortunately, many of our systems are built in ways
> > that contradict those rules and make our content difficult to index
> > and find.
> >
> > But it's a challenge we can meet. And considering that a good number
> > of those billions of monthly searches could benefit from the
> > knowledge available within libraries, it's a challenge that's worth
> > our effort.
> >
> > That's the philosophy, here's some practice:
> >
> > WPopac[1] is my project to improve the findability of our resources
> > by following the rules of the Google Economy[2]. In doing so it's
> > already highly ranked for at least one search[3], and the logs show
> > that it's getting a large number of hits from search engines for
> > terms like "di vinci code" (yes, note the misspelling)  and "assisted
> > suicide" along with a few hundred more. How many hits? In the less
> > than three months that the prototype has been open to the public,
> > it's received more than 550,000 page loads (that count excludes my
> > own activity), about as many as official Plymouth State University
> > catalog received in 12 months last year.
> >
> > 1: http://maisonbisson.com/blog/post/11133/
> >
> > 2: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_economy
> >
> > 3: http://www.google.com/search?q=joe+monninger
> >
> > Casey Bisson
> > __________________________________________
> >
> > e-Learning Application Developer
> > Plymouth State University
> > Plymouth, New Hampshire
> > http://oz.plymouth.edu/~cbisson/
> > ph: 603-535-2256
> >
> >
> > On Apr 10, 2006, at 5:55 PM, Sara Brownmiller wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> There is interest here in allowing google (google the search
> >> engine, not
> >> google scholar) to spider, or crawl, our library catalog.  Since many
> >> students start their research in google, they might identify
> >> information
> >> easily available to them.  It would also help increase exposure to
> >> materials in our digital collections and our special collections and
> >> manuscripts.
> >>
> >> Has anyone allowed a search engine to crawl their catalog?  What
> >> impact
> >> did it have on the performance?  Does your library have a policy
> >> about
> >> search engines crawling your catalog?  What factors influenced your
> >> decision?
> >>
> >> I would also be very interested in locating some records in google
> >> that
> >> came from a library catalog to see how the user is linked to the
> >> catalog
> >> or to see how the material is identified with a specific institution.
> >>
> >> thanks, Sara
> >>
> >> Sara Brownmiller			University of Oregon Libraries
> >> Director, Library Systems 		1299 University of Oregon
> >> Women's Studies Librarian		Eugene, OR  97403-1299
> >> 					541/346-2368 (voice)
> >> snb at uoregon.edu				541/346-3485 (fax)
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Web4lib mailing list
> >> Web4lib at webjunction.org
> >> http://lists.webjunction.org/web4lib/
> >
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