CSS and web site design

[Andrew Mutch]

I've definitely been giving this more thought after reading the Zeldman
article that was posted to the list recently.  If you haven't read it yet,
you can find it here:

http://www.alistapart.com/stories/journey/

The gist of the article is the need for web designers to get serious about
separating content from presentation.  He also pushed for web designers to
stop doing design hacks to support 4.x browsers and to lead the push for
standards-compliant browsers.

With the exception of some details about implementing CSS, he wasn't saying
anything that hasn't already been covered in one way or another on this
list.  I know a number of people on this list, like Thomas Dowling, have
already made this leap on their personal sites. But seeing these concepts in
action on a production site was something to behold.  Isn't it a wonder to
browse the code for a site with some detailed design elements and not see
one <table> or <td> or <font> tag in sight?  The promise of CSS was the
ability to make global changes by updating one file.  Is it finally a
reality?

One good thing that Zeldman does point out is that the process of transition
isn't an easy one.  I have to admit that the idea of identifying all of the
potential position and style elements in a large site is rather daunting.
Still, I think he makes a good point that the train is getting ready to
leave the station.  You can either be on the train or get run over by it.
As the current discussion points out, HTML just isn't hacking it for the
variety of design situations that we are dealing with today (as if it ever
did and we weren't all hacking it in one form or another).  I'm not sure if
CSS is "the solution" but it seems much better suited for what we are facing
these days.

Another good thing is that Zeldman points out that you don't have to be a
fanatic on this issue.  As he illustrates, you can still accomodate 4.x
browsers, they just won't necessarily get the information presented the way
it was intended.  All of us know that we still have users out there with 3.x
and 4.x  browsers.  It would be nice to have everyone coming to us with
CSS-compliant browsers.  But why continue to hack things together for the
lowest-common denominator?

There are a lot of implementation issues to work out, that's for sure.  I'm
wondering how I can make this user-friendly for library staff who actually
have to design the web pages?  I've been encouraging them to think of
content and presentation as separate elements. But can they do that in their
actual work?  We work with FrontPage 2000.  Will the product be a help or
hinderance in this regard?  I'm looking forward to seeing sites that have
made the leap and hearing from people who have survived the jump.  Who's
going first?

Andrew Mutch
Library Systems Technician
Waterford Township Public Library
Waterford, MI


"Gimon, Charles A" wrote:

> >
> > I tell ya, it isn't PDAs that are going to kill pixel-based
> > screen design.
> > It will be 21" 1600x1200 monitors hitting the $600US price
> > point.  That
> > will nicely do in any GIFs of words in the Right Fonts standing in for
> > real headers, too.
> >
> > Thomas Dowling
> > OhioLINK - Ohio Library and Information Network
> > tdowling at ohiolink.edu
> >
>
> It would also help to have popular browsers that implement
> all of CSS1 properly after...how many years is it? Five now?
>
> --Charles Gimon
>   Web Coordinator
>   Minneapolis Public Library