[Web4lib] Federated searching-general question re sub groupings
Lef, Yuliya
ylef at coloradomtn.edu
Wed May 16 14:51:55 EDT 2007
Peter,
You've mentioned that concurrent license issue could be sorted out with
the provider. Could you be a bit more specific about that. I don't think
I understand how it could be sorted out.
Thanks so much,
-----------------------------
Yuliya Lef
Virtual Library Coordinator
Colorado Mountain College
333 Fiedler Ave.
P.O. Box 1414
Dillon, CO 80435
970-468-5989 (phone)
970-468-5018 (fax)
ylef at coloradomtn.edu
http://www.coloradomtn.edu/library/
> -----Original Message-----
> From: web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org
> [mailto:web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org] On Behalf Of Peter Noerr
> Sent: Monday, May 14, 2007 11:42 AM
> To: web4lib at webjunction.org
> Subject: RE: [Web4lib] Federated searching-general question
> re sub groupings
>
> Aren't these all examples of "shouldn't" rather than "can't".
> Numeric DBs are just as useful as text ones if the data is
> properly fielded for display ("gold price=$700" vs. "price of
> gold is rising"). Any examples of pay-per-search? Number of
> concurrent licenses is a matter of session management, but I
> agree they should probably not be included, because of the
> prevalence of "just search everywhere" syndrome, unless the
> concurrent license issue is sorted out with the provider -
> which an increasing number are.
>
> Peter
>
>
> > Well, there could be a number of reasons why certain
> databases can't be included in a federated search, or
> probably shouldn't be. Numeric databases, pay-per-search
> databases, and databases with a small number of concurrent
> users are examples.
> >
> > --Steve
> > ___________________________________________________
> > Steve Cramer
> > Librarian for Accounting, Apparel, Business, & Economics
> University of
> > North Carolina at Greensboro smcramer at uncg.edu, 336-256-0346, AIM:
> > stevebizlib
> >
> >
> >
> > "Peter Noerr" <pnoerr at MuseGlobal.com> Sent by:
> > web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org
> > 05/10/2007 06:10 PM
> >
> > To
> > <web4lib at webjunction.org>
> > cc
> >
> > Subject
> > RE: [Web4lib] Federated searching-general question re sub groupings
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > One question and one observation:
> >
> > Question:
> >
> > Kathryn (in her ACRL presentation) and one other poster on
> this thread
> > have mentioned that certain databases "cannot be searched
> by federated
> > search" (or similar, more succinct phrasing). I am
> intrigued to know
> > what some examples of the databases are, or what the
> characteristics
> > are which make them unsearchable by a federated search engine.
> >
> > Observation:
> > We have noticed a growing trend in both the corporate and
> library use
> > of federated search towards the use of "subject verticals". The
> > reasons are all over the place, but one major theme is that
> users want
> > less, but better 'quality' results. If the user is already in a
> > subject specialized part of the web site, then the
> expectation seems
> > to be that they will get only very relevant material. And the
> > converse; if they are on the front page, they will get all sorts of
> > stuff.
> >
> > Also it is easier to consider moving a specialized search
> box out to
> > the place where the users are likely to be (a course web site, or
> > project collaboration page, for example) thus getting them
> to use the
> > library without having to be there. (This mixes with
> another thread,
> > but it does seem to be a trend to move specialist access
> out to where
> > people are
> > working.)
> >
> >
> > Disclaimer:
> > In the interests of full disclosure; MuseGlobal is a major
> commercial
> > developer and OEM vendor of search management software,
> which includes
> > federated search and results analysis components.
> >
> > Peter
> >
> > Dr Peter L Noerr
> > CTO, MuseGlobal, Inc.
> >
> > +1 801 208 1880
> > www.museglobal.com
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org
> > > [mailto:web4lib-bounces at webjunction.org] On Behalf Of Kathryn
> > > Silberger
> > > Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2007 6:10 AM
> > > To: web4lib at webjunction.org
> > > Subject: Fw: [Web4lib] Federated searching-general
> question re sub
> > > groupings
> > >
> > > Lisa:
> > >
> > > I think you have asked some good questions. I am at Marist
> > > College and we have been using federated search since
> fall of 2005.
> > > Our students
> > > have been receptive and postive about it. We have it front and
> > > center on our home page and we have seen article usage sky rocket.
> > > When we set it up
> > > we tried to look at searching from the student's perspective, and
> > > that led us to use the terminology of the Registrar's
> office. Each
> > > of our federated groupings bear the name of a major
> awarded by the
> > > college.
> > > That is the
> > > terminology that guides their overall academic experience and we
> > > have found that it works well for grouping databases into
> federated
> > > searches. I agree with you that students don't want to have to
> > > consider lots
> > of choices
> > > before searching. They live with a fair number of web
> destinations
> > > for broad life activities i.e. socializing, banking, travel,
> > > shopping -- I believe they would like the library to be a single
> > > destination.
> > >
> > > You are quite right about the clustering. Students
> have been
> > > conditioned by other web searching experience to using
> clusters to
> > > filter search results. (They want the movie, not the
> book at Amazon
> > > - they filter
> > > via cluster.) About 80% - 90% of the time the clustering will
> > > create a
> > > very relevant subset. Those proposed sub-grouping would
> > > have some general
> > > academic databases and they would need to use the clustering
> > > regardless. I have found that newspapers can present a
> problem in
> > > certain situations. If a technical topic has been in the
> news for
> > > whatever reason, you can get the first page of results
> with too many
> > > newspaper articles.
> > >
> > > We gave a paper on federated searching at ACRL this
> > > year. We put up our paper, Powerpoint and a couple Flash
> demos at
> > > http://library.marist.edu/ACRL/Foxhunt_demo.html . You
> can see the
> > > clustering in each of the Flashes.
> > >
> > > Good luck. I think you are on the right track.
> > >
> > >
> > > Katy
> > >
> > > Kathryn K. Silberger
> > > Automation Resources Librarian
> > > James A. Cannavino Library
> > > Marist College
> > > 3399 North Road
> > > Poughkeepsie, NY 12601
> > > Kathryn.Silberger at marist.edu
> > > (845) 575-3000 x.2419
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "Pons, Lisa
> > >
> > > (ponslm)"
> > >
> > > <PONSLM at UCMAIL.UC
> > > To
> > > .EDU>
> > > <web4lib at webjunction.org>
> > > Sent by:
> > > cc
> > > web4lib-bounces at w
> > >
> > > ebjunction.org
> > > Subject
> > > [Web4lib] Federated
> > >
> > > searching-general
> question re
> > > sub
> > > 05/09/2007 10:18 groupings
> > >
> > > AM
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I have a general question- sorry this is so long!
> > >
> > > We're a few steps away from implementing our new federated search
> > > tool.
> > > It has been an interesting experience!
> > >
> > > I have some questions regarding how this tool is seen across your
> > > institutions- that is, what is the vision for it's use?
> > >
> > > For example, we have created our tool with 21 subject
> > categories. Now,
> > > some of our subject specialists want to create sub
> categories, and
> > > choose their own databases to be searched , and put a
> search box on
> > > their subject guide pages that will only search within their sub
> > > category.
> > >
> > > For example, on our main federated page, we have Earth and
> > > Environmental Sciences which includes 10 databases to be
> searched.
> > > Now,
> > the subject
> > > specialist wants to create a sub-category for Geography
> and put the
> > > search box on her subject guide page. The category may or
> > may not have
> > > the same databases as the main earth and environmental
> sciences main
> > > category.
> > >
> > > My question is, won't this confuse users? Does this
> > partially defeat
> > > the purpose of a "federated search" by limiting the
> search to a very
> > > slender set of resources? We are using Serials solutions central
> > > search, which has Vivisimo to cluser results- shouldn't that be
> > > enough.
> > >
> > > Isn't this kind of library 1.0 thinking- that every tool must be
> > > separate, and to find this, you must go there, to find that, you
> > > must go somewhere else.
> > >
> > > I need help here- if I am wrong I need to shut up about
> it with my
> > > colleagues, if I am write, I need help from all the experts
> > out there
> > > explaining why it is wrong.
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > > _______________________________________________
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> > > Web4lib at webjunction.org
> > > http://lists.webjunction.org/web4lib/
> > >
> > >
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